Thursday, March 18, 2010

Is Turkey run by insane folks

The genocide denial bit of Turkey is a bit much. Germany to its credit has never denied or rationalized the Holocaust. Turkey needs to own up to its past and move forward. I want to add that Assyrian and Greek Christians were slaughtered as well.

To add insult to injury the comedy team in Turkey is talking about expelling Armenians from lands that they and not the Anatolian invaders are indigenous upon.

Who is running the show in Turkey??? Is this David Irving redux any way for a responsible government to behave.

Plenty of American leaders have acknowledged the wrongs against Native Americans and slavery.
Turkey needs to own up to its history.


Always On Watch said...

Isn't Mein Kampf still a bestseller in Turkey? If so, that speaks volumes.

The Pagan Temple said...

It's not that simple. Yes, they should acknowledge it, but on the other hand, this whole deal is mostly political. We would not be pushing this if it were not for the Armenian diaspora lobby, and the fact that it might be a way to drive a wedge between the US and Turkey doesn't hurt either, seeing as how most of the people pushing this aren't exactly in love with our Iraq policy.

By the way, the three people deemed most responsible for the massacre of the Armenians, were tried, convicted, and sentenced to death, although their sentences were held up. They were eventually assassinated. They were the Interior Minister, the War Minister, and the head of the Ottoman Navy.

Finally, it's a different government now. The Ottoman government no longer exists, it was replaced by the secular government created by Ataturk. Yes, he had been a part of the Young Turks movement, and yes, there was a cohesiveness that ran through both governments, but that doesn't change the fact they represented a change in policy. You will seldom see a change in government where some factions don't remain ensconced. When Hitler took over Germany, he left the previous civil service mostly untouched. That system probably remained there after he was gone. That's just par for the course.

I'm not defending the actions of the Ottoman Empire, and I don't approve of the denial extant in today's Turkish government. On the other hand, they have been trying to establish normalized relations with the current government of Armenia. Plus, I'm not sure the US should be pushing this to begin with. This is more of the old attack your friends, make nice with your enemies philosophy of Obama and the Democrats.

Actions have consequences. We would do well to remember that when we consider the next time we might need to move troops through Turkish territory. Yes, its an ugly process, nothing pretty about it, but the bad thing about reality is, it is often not pretty. The consequences of not recognizing those hard realities though can be even uglier.

In a perfect world, Turkey would issue some kind of official statement acknowledging their crimes, and they would vow to pursue policies that would show they intend to rectify those past misdeeds, to what extent that is possible, and to make some kind of just settlement with the survivors families.

Then again, the US maybe should pay reparations for slavery as well, huh? I think the best thing to do is acknowledge there are certain things that might happen, or they might not, and we should just deal with the reality we have.

When the US Congress pushes things like this-especially a Democratic Congress-I tend to want to look behind the curtain and see whose pushing the buttons, and to what end. Of course, we all know that Democrats are such solid, patriotic Americans, they would never pursue a policy that might endanger our position in Iraq or the Middle East.

The_Editrix said...

Beak asks: "Who is running the show in Turkey???"


AOW says: "Isn't Mein Kampf still a bestseller in Turkey? If so, that speaks volumes."

It's in the entire Muslim world. Islam is the only ideology that is more dangerous than all Western "-isms" together. Therefore the latter tend to feel such a strong affinity to it. It is just that the millions of victims are of no account because they are mostly third worlders or near-third worlders. Armenia aside, who is interested in Darfur or the genocide in India or the other genocides Islam committed during its infamous history? As much as you'll hate that, Beak, but Communism will still have to go a long way to top that. (Not that this makes it more palatable!)

CM said...


You said many, I could only wish!

For any ONE person of importance like say....President Obama to admit anything or just "try' to acknowledge any wrong, there are people like badeagle who calls it crying and being pitiful and winters who parrots stupid ignorant foreign dead quotes from a racist foreigner. Dickens needed to clean up his own dirty house before speaking ill of the Native American Indians whom he knew nothing about. How could he know about "all" the Indians of American, to go and label us? Thats how some people continue to label the Blacks and Indians to this day.

We have come a long way, but to some, it will never be good enough....



sonia said...

Turkey needs to own up to its history
It won't. The political correctness is for the Western sissies. The Muslim world is entering its "alpha male" stage: "Never apologize".

Rejected by Europe, Turkey is gearing itself to regain the influence it once had in the Muslim world before 1918.

It's not all bad. Better a Muslim world led by Turkey than by Iran...

Anonymous said...

That's not bad at all! What were we talking about?

The_Editrix said...

"It's not all bad. Better a Muslim world led by Turkey than by Iran..."

You are being naive. Islam is Islam. If Turkey seems to be somewhat less awful that Iran (or Saudi Arabia, for that) it is because Islam hasn't (yet and just) managed to re-conquer the formerly secular Turkish state. But it will.

beakerkin said...


Long term Iran will be okay after an uprising hits. The clerics have misruled enough so that we might get an more pragmatic type focused on jobs.


The current regime is going down a steep path to irrelevance. It needs
to get its act together.

The current secular government has a bloody foundation. In times of economic unrest religious revivals
are rife. Ultimately the best way to defuse Islamic radicalism is to
get people working.

Commies are well aware that gainfully employed people do not riot. Therefore they work 24/7 to sabotage the economy and stir Mulsims up.

The_Editrix said...

Beak, have you noticed what those hailed rioters are wearing? They are not fighting for Western values, they are, if anything, fighting for the right to twitter.

Islam is not reformable and those green-wearing protesters are not the fighters for democracy and Western values as which we want to see them.

Anonymous said...

Speaking of Western values as which we want to see them. Have you actually looked at what Sonia is wearing on her avatar? It's not green, that's for sure. I can actually see why the strict Islamists could have a problem with women like her. It's the burka vs. nude all the time, Garden of Eden style. What a blog she has too! Take a look at her favorite picture, if you dare. Beak, are you sure you want to advertise for that? I mean, it's totally up to you, for sure, you being the host and all.

beakerkin said...


Sonia is brilliant and vexes communist and jihadists of all types.Never let her interests on film distract you from her depth.

You can find a great interview with her here. You can also see her debate the Marxist Duck on film.

She has a range of interests from film, architecture, politics and has a caustic wit. She destroys commies on their turf, but they are
too stunned to figure it out.

I guess when we deal with commies she is the sunshine and I am the wind. A little sunshine sends the Bolshevik roaches running for "ahem" cover.

Anonymous said...

May the wind not pass where the sun don't shine because it's then that you have to hold your nose.

From the blog of Sunshine:

As Sonia says, she loves this picture.

Say, Cateran (Mac), at this point in my life I think I'm gravitating towards Ellen and away from Dionysus, but I'm still somewheres in between.

Anonymous said...

Sonia's list of interests:

* politics
* art
* cinema
* sex
* nudism
* nude wrestling
* pornography
* lesbianism
* bisexuality
* exhibitionism

Well, Hell Yeah! She calls her favorite picture above "divine"? Well let me look up the word divine again cause I was almost sure I knew what that meant.

Hey, the conservative big tent just got a little bigger!

Dionysus said...

Here's my prediction. The EU will drag it's feet on the subject of Turkish entry thereof, which will elicit an undignified indignant response from the Turko-Islamists, who have all along been plotting entry into the EU as their pincer move for the conquest of Europe. But, by that time there will be a Turkish majority in Germany that will cajole the minority Germans into siding with them, AGAIN, to take over Europe just like in WW1 (and 2, for that matter) and we'll have the makings of WW3 on our hands.

Sonia never cheated on her husband with a man. OK. In other words, she exhibits the utmost fidelity concerning her husband except when it comes to women. This is a very peculiar man. Couple, I should say. I guess he'd do anything to mouth those tits and dirty his chin.

The_Editrix said...

Re-reading your blog entry, I noticed that: "Turkey needs to own up to its history."

That is exactly what it does. Do you think 90 years of Kemalism top 1000 years of Islam? Besides, secular Turkey isn't exactly a haven of freedom and liberty. That's wishful thinking. Case in point: Round the turn of the last century (BEFORE Kemalism was introduced) roughly 20 % of the Turkish population was Christian, and in 1923 100,000 Jews were counted. Currently, Turkey boasts a whopping minority of 0.2 % Christians and 0,04 % Jews, about 20,000. Go figure!

Turkey is exactly doing what you are saying. It's owning up to its history. Remember the Battle of Vienna? Everything where Mohammedans once set foot on is considered Dar al-Islam for all eternity. What they are doing now (the re-conquest of Europe) is only the logical outcome of that. Owning up to their history indeed!

Never wish for something, Beak. It might be fulfilled.

beakerkin said...


The Jews of Turkey were left alone. As for the population there was a second factor. When Greece declared independence there was a population exchange. Many of the people who were displaced went to what is known as the West Bank where they are calledPsuedostians. Estimates that around 3% to 5% are descended from displacedEuropeans. However, don't hold your breath for vermin like Galloway to point
out that like Jews many Psudostinian names show that they
originated elsewhere.


I do not hold a persons sex life against them. Sonia's arrangement with her husband is her own business. Many NYC men would not be
bothered by that arrangement, not me but it remains a fact.

Among the many people who read this blog who have enjoyed her site
for the brilliant political pieces
are Mr. Beamish, Mustang, American Crusader and Steve Harkonen.

Sonia is brilliant and a glance at the political posts speaks for itself. As far as conservative, I do not make this claim about myself. I am a Republican, but a social liberal. Many here are are libertarians.

I also might add we do have one or two excellent posters who are gay.
I consider them to be valued friends even if one of them insists
on watching American Idol.

The_Editrix said...

Beak, if you consider Sonia a friend, why do you let an anonymous poster besmirch her name here? You are not defending her, you allow him (or her) to go on with those insults and give them a credibility they don't possess. You know the old quip about pigs? Never wrestle with one because you will get dirty and the pig will like it.

beakerkin said...

I wrote a more detailed response up top. Sonia has a more spirited defense on her blog.

I am a NYC type in heart and soul. As such I am more adaptable and tolerant than others.

NYC is a magical place where what matters most is your talents and drive. A NYC type is expected in a normal life to understand and participate in the culture of the person next door.

There are those like Rav Roov who stay rooted in their own culture. Yet even as religious and as culturally literal as the beloved Rav Roov is he would never think of criticizing someone for practicing another religion or ever advocate people jail gays. He leaves his religious beliefs at the temple and helps in the community.

Sometimes, I forget how special NYC
is and need to be reminded.

Among Sonia's fans are the great
Mr. Beamish, Mustang and Steve Harkonen. They enjoy her brilliance on various topics.

The_Editrix said...

Beak, this is not about approving or disapproving of Sonia. I strongly disapprove of her way of life, in fact, I am disgusted by it. But I keep this outlook to myself because it has nothing to do with what we are discussing here. Should I ever want not to be seen in her company, I'd stay away and not discuss it here out of respect for you. No, this is about the fact that you allow your blog to be hijacked and your debate here interrupted by an anonymous troll. This is not somebody who disapproves of Sonia, but somebody who wants to disrupt the discussion here at any cost. You are not liberal, but a weakling if you allow that. This is not meant as a comment, just as a message to you.

Anonymous said...

Who? Me?

Dionysius said...

Beaker said: "Never let her [Sonia] interests on film distract you from her depth."

It's not her interests in film that's distracting me. How deep is she, by the way? Oop. Sorry, got distracted again.

Frau Brinker (aka, The Hunting Girl) said: "Beak, have you noticed what those hailed rioters are wearing?"

Were they nude too? Nooo!

The Hunting Girl:

Nora said: "Beak, if you consider Sonia a friend, why do you let an anonymous poster besmirch her name here?"

How dare you of accusing me of besmirching her name! I jus be searching her picture, that's all! Or was it, be smootching her picture. All right, I confess! Dang! I must be a liberal too! Is this what they call a "divine" revelation, Sonia?

Beaker said: "Sonia's arrangement with her husband is her own business."

Is that why she is advertising it to the World Wide Web on your blog in this tread? The thread with the girl with no threads.

Again, I reiterate. What would an aviatrix know about hijacking?

This is a riddle.
No rhyme or reason.

Ah, come on! This thread is fast receding into the recesses of our collective memories. No one will see it, henceforth, except those that are obsessed and have too much time on their hands. Me included. Besides, Beak doesn't have a PM mode on his blog, or I'd message him. I just like razing this Jew boy and it's better this than on the frontispiece, out of respect to him, the host. He's such a likable sort, you know?

I, for one, will not resort to self segregating myself from people I like, even if they say offensive things every once in a while.

Now, back on topic. There's a Turk looking behind a rock for you, Beakerkin. And the rock is calling out to the Turk,"Come and kill this Jew hiding behind me!" The Turk is named Suleyman (That's Solomon in Jewlatin.).

I could go for some nude wrestling right about now.

Abada Abada Abadalibobadabada. That's all folks!

CM said...


I was wondering who you all were speakng of...Sonia.

Guys will be guys huh!

I got nosey and looked sonia up. did say for Adults only. I think badeagle could use a little pick me up by now, he's and his roosters are all crying around about America, "Black" sunday and all. Sonia maybe could give him a visit and shock him back to Reality. He does like redheads afterall!


CM said...

I forgot, I think anonymous sounds like Mark Winters lusting after Sonya, why.....he could invite her over for a nite cap with his mentor that would be just cute!


Cateran said...

Mark said...From the blog of Sunshine:

As Sonia says, she loves this picture.

I take it you like it too?

Naughty boy, Mark.

beakerkin said...

The fact that there is serious discussion on many levels is obviously obscured by the nudity. Shame on those who do not see the forest for the trees.

The_Editrix said...

Beak, as I said, I won't discuss my views on Sonia here, but if you think they have anything (but ANYTHING!) to do with nudity, think again.

The Pagan Temple said...

I don't care about the forest OR the trees. All I see is the bush.

Dionysius said...

I don't care what they say. Mac is a good guy.

Cateran said...

Ah, unanimity.

The_Editrix said...

"I don't care about the forest OR the trees. All I see is the bush."


CM said...

But..some of the bushes are gone, are't they put there for a reason?

Do men shave that area too...for nudity? I guess I never bothered to notice, and don't want to find out either!