Tuesday, July 15, 2008

Personal Liberty

I want to revisit the issue of Burkas and Citizenship.

The issue here is personal liberty vs failure to integrate.

The type of clothing we wear is a matter of personal choice. Are the rest of you out there ready to deny citizenship to Chasidic Jews, Rastafarians, Amish and people who wear African costume as well. I do understand that in some instances the Burka may be
imposed by intimidation but there is no evidence it was in this case.

The notion of intergration is a lousy concept legally. The concept should be changed to respect for others and private property. If a person can respect that other people have the right to dress and live differently this is sufficient. Any desire to kill Jews, Gays or whomever based upon them being themselves would be grounds for denial of citizenship as this person would clearly not respect the existing laws.

Commies do not respect the concept of private property and advocate the violent over throw of governments. Their values conflict with those of the United States and should be a bar to citizenship.

I am curious as to how Stephen Schwartz would view this matter. The Burka is not and has not been tied to Islamic practice. It is a recent trend that is akin to wearing a Che beret. However, does one have the right to personal autonomy and liberty within reasonable lengths?


The Merry Widow said...

Beaker-The burka is NOT a "cultural" issue, it's a CONTROL and Superiority issue.
Hassidic Jews DO NOT threaten the integrity of the countries they live in. I knew several African immigrants in San Jose, they wore their native costumes to church, as did 2 ladies from India, they were and are not threats to the integrity of the countries they are in.
They ALL have assimilated to a greater or lesser degree, they are productive taxpayers and good citizens.
Any native costumes just add to the flavor of an area...along with some really good food!
Burkas ARE NOT NATIVE COSTUMES! They are symbols of a way of thinking that is inimical to our way of life!
We ARE multiethnic, we enjoy it and celebrate it, BUT, when I go to the grocery store or Walmart, I DO NOT ENJOY being intimidated(or at least knowing that the idea is there to intimidate)by some black clad crow who acts like I'm the scum of the Earth!
And where were all these burkas and hijabs BEFORE 9/11? They popped out of nowhere overnight!
THAT tells me that it is ALL symbolic!
And let me tell you, it is offensive to me to see this in your face repudiation of what America stands for! It is a deliberate and in your face slap...and France has the right AND duty to protect her citizens from the subtle and not so subtle intimidation tactics of the mohammadins!
Good on France!
Good morning, G*D bless and Maranatha!


Beamish said...

Young, underdeveloped turd world pseudo-nations like France (its current incarnation is only 64 years old) have never had the opportunity to be introduced to and integrated within Western Civilization, so we can't really expect them to rise above barbarism and social squalor. We are talking about the birthplace of leftism, afterall.

I think this is just a case of too little, too late. The snail-eating dogshit farmers of Paris can't even enforce the public laws of their own Algerian-colonized neighborhoods and now they want to dictate the dress code of their latest unopposed invaders?

Good luck with that, Pierre.

kevin said...

Like I said before, if she says otherwise her husband or closest male relative is free to contemplate honorcide.

33:30 O ye wives of the Prophet! Whosoever of you committeth manifest lewdness, the punishment for her will be doubled, and that is easy for Allah

66:5 It may happen that his Lord, if he divorce you, will give him in your stead wives better than you, submissive (to Allah), believing, pious, penitent, devout, inclined to fasting, widows and maids.

And yes, the Burka is required.

33:59 O Prophet! Tell thy wives and thy daughters and the women of the believers to draw their cloaks close round them

Polygamy 4:3

Inferiority of women
4:11, 2:228, 2:282, 4:34

Not allowed to leave the house without a male relative present.

The Burka is more than just a cultural or religious garment. It's an open proclamation of property.

The Pagan Temple said...

Beak, what are you smoking. Why shouldn't immigrants to a country be expected to assimilate? You act like assimilation means doing away totally with your cultural heritage. You know as well as I do that it don't mean that at all. There are still Polish neighborhoods, and Italian neighborhoods, and Irish neighborhoods, in the US, and for that matter African American and even, yes, Latino neighborhoods, where the people have assimilated into the US mainstream without losing their cultural identity, in such matters as dress, music, food, religion, all kinds of ways.

But they are still Americans and hopefully see themselves as that first and foremost. These Muslims that impose the burkha on their wives and daughters, and all their womenfolk, have demonstrated for all the world to see that they have no intention of assimilating.

Okay, then, fine, I want to be able to go into a Muslim store or restaurant and not wear a stitch of clothing. To hell with them, I have as much right to do that as they have to walk around dressed in some kind of garb that makes it impossible to tell who they are.

Unless it has escaped your notice, it's against the law in most places in the US to walk around with your identity or your features concealed. This was partially aimed at the Ku Klux Klan, but it applies to everybody.

By God, Muslims are not special cases who deserve some kind of special rights or treatment, quit treating them like they are.

The Merry Widow said...

Well said, PT.
Good morning, G*D bless and Maranatha!


Beamish said...

By God, Muslims are not special cases who deserve some kind of special rights or treatment, quit treating them like they are.

Muslim women emigrating to France should at least compromise and wear berets and ascots over their burkas.

Mark said...

Please check this out: French Minister Denounces Burqah

Ducky's here said...

Beak, check out BBC. Seems that Muslim women in the French government support the ruling.

Mark said...


Did you receive my long comment, posted on this post a few days ago. It was more of an essay rather than a comment; a lot of effort and thought went into writing it. I am therefore disappointed to find that it hasn't been posted. Has it, perhaps, been censored?

beakerkin said...


I do not censor comments. I do understand the effort most of us make
in writing them and post them whether
I agree or not.

Mark said...


So where did my long comment go?

beakerkin said...

I honestly do not know but blogger is quirky

Mark said...


It must have got lost then. That's such a pity.

In future, when I write something long like that, I shall save it to Word before publishing it.