tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post114300159211735397..comments2024-02-20T21:48:16.978-05:00Comments on The Beak Speaks: Hard to Believe but Anum Muhktar in the Hot Seat???beakerkinhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06088967209404588378noreply@blogger.comBlogger49125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143315440701940142006-03-25T14:37:00.000-05:002006-03-25T14:37:00.000-05:00the phenomenon CANNOT be fully explained - but the...the phenomenon CANNOT be fully explained - but there is enough to confirm diety. ironic how a relationship with G-d just leaves you longing for more - never satisfied. He is so intriguing.nanchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08809768490674110768noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143257751876886972006-03-24T22:35:00.000-05:002006-03-24T22:35:00.000-05:00Apostate, thanks for the answer on this one.Nanc, ...Apostate, thanks for the answer on this one.<BR/>Nanc, and anyone else who wondered, I just happened to have seen Mother Angelica on EWTN discussing the "I Am" aspect of scripture right before I read this and one of the questions above (don't even remember which one)just brought it to my mind.Kiddohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05626502212185158978noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143236572764691492006-03-24T16:42:00.000-05:002006-03-24T16:42:00.000-05:00Kev,You are correct.There is no way that democracy...Kev,<BR/>You are correct.<BR/>There is no way that democracy is possible with Islam not fully separated from the state.<BR/>Then if you take Islam seriously you cannot separate it from the state because it means automatic apostasy.<BR/>Mustafa Kemal tried to go around this problem by putting mullahs on the state payroll and organizing government funded Muslim seminaries (schools for mullahs) and so he created a version of State Islam.<BR/>Yet, as soon as he tried, during his time as the leader of Turkey, to move away from dictatorship into "more" democratic form of government, the Muslim parties immediately gained the upper hand tried to get rid of the church-state separation in all aspects of public life.<BR/>We can observe a similar phenomenon in Indonesia, where removal of dictatorship encouraged militant Islam to seek Islamization of the state (Sharia), which still has both civil and criminal law based on colonial Dutch legislation.Dan Zarembahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09067140150563192288noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143148047009725312006-03-23T16:07:00.000-05:002006-03-23T16:07:00.000-05:00So Amun,Are you a member of the Islamic Thinkers S...So Amun,<BR/><BR/>Are you a member of the Islamic Thinkers Society (<A HREF="http://www.islamicthinkers.com/index/index.php" REL="nofollow">ITS</A>)? Most of your web-site postings seem to have rather <A HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Thinkers_Society" REL="nofollow">radical</A> "roots" there. Wasn't that a branch of the Muslim Brotherhood? Just curious.<BR/><BR/>-FJAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143130260883924882006-03-23T11:11:00.000-05:002006-03-23T11:11:00.000-05:00p.s. p.g. - what is most curious is why this forum...p.s. p.g. - what is most curious is why this forum, and why now? the cop in me is overwhelming the sensible me. they're doing battle as we speak - stop it! dayam i wish those two would knock it off!nanchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08809768490674110768noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143129711288571302006-03-23T11:01:00.000-05:002006-03-23T11:01:00.000-05:00if, and that's a big if, he ever did - he is an im...if, and that's a big if, he ever did - he is an imposter. a wannabe - they say that's who the enemy will portray in the end of days. think about it. could be a type or shadow of things to come. the Shepherd knows the sheep as well as the sheep know the Shepherd. <BR/><BR/>remember, theirs is not to identify or question - theirs is to obey. ours is to identify and question and obey accordingly. there is a difference as wide as the chasm in abraham's bosom, if you know what i mean.nanchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08809768490674110768noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143126505440559072006-03-23T10:08:00.000-05:002006-03-23T10:08:00.000-05:00nanc--I don't know why this all just now occured t...nanc--I don't know why this all just now occured to me, and I do agree that "I Am" was not the one speaking to MO. Actually, I think the talking was being done by Mo entirely. Still, I became curious last night on this one. There has been much theological work on this subject in both Judaism and Christianity. But is there any of this identification in the quran? "Allah" describes himself in many ways, such as being "merciful" to those who follow his guidelines, etc., but does he ever as "I Am"?Kiddohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05626502212185158978noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143124471241081502006-03-23T09:34:00.000-05:002006-03-23T09:34:00.000-05:00p.g. - when i began studying the "I Am" aspect - i...p.g. - when i began studying the "I Am" aspect - i nearly went mad - it was like a family tree that went back thousands of years before i finally said "enough!" we'll never know fully that aspect of G-d in this life. it was meant to be that way. powerful - mighty powerful. i do know this, the Great "I Am" was not the one speaking to muhammed the child molester.nanchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08809768490674110768noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143122743652885432006-03-23T09:05:00.000-05:002006-03-23T09:05:00.000-05:00missing--that statement from "Allah" is not quite ...missing--that statement from "Allah" is not quite the same as giving identity as "I am". I need more. Of course if it is there, it can also be assumed that Mo borrowed it as he borrowed so much else. But I'm still curious.Kiddohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05626502212185158978noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143114313573179982006-03-23T06:45:00.000-05:002006-03-23T06:45:00.000-05:00Orange Ducks: Religion doesn't matter much in the ...Orange Ducks: <BR/><I>Religion doesn't matter much in the typical Western mindset. Not so for much of the world, especially the Muslim parts.<BR/><BR/>The Eurolib elites and American university despots will tell you that the current clash is due to past international territorial disputes, or 20th-century corporate greed, or lack of economic opportunity.<BR/><BR/>But the main difference is RELIGION and CULTURE. No one is at fault for those things, but when they clash, there is no quick and easy cause, nor is there a quick and easy fix.<BR/><BR/>The divide between modern Western and Muslim values is HUGE, as Anum's interview here clearly indicates.</I><BR/><BR/>I'm nodding my head in agreement. Thanks to the pc and multiculti crowd, we have lost our cultural conviction, along with the moral conviction.<BR/><BR/>Recently, I read that Tony Blair doesn't want to refer to the West as "we." He refuses to face the threat.<BR/><BR/>Our leaders want dialogue and compromise, but Anum shows us the certitude that Muslims have about the tenets they hold. The West, on the other hand, has become wishy-washy.<BR/><BR/>Let me be clear....I harbor no animosity toward Anum. I disagree, but that's different.<BR/><BR/>Anum's statement that shari'ah law is better upsets me greatly as shari'ah law does not incorporate American values. And if shari'ah law conflicts with American Constitutional law, Muslims are to follow shari'ah law, right? Isn't Paradise at stake, as Missing Link pointed out?<BR/><BR/>It doesn't bother me in the least that Muslims seem to believe that those of us who are not are doomed to hell. Pushing me into that confine is another matter altogether, of course.<BR/><BR/>Now, I am product enough of American culture to feel uneasy even posing the questions I did. But Anum is convinced of her path. See the difference? And that difference may bring down Western civilization.Always On Watchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01216119321836479641noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143106250534284742006-03-23T04:30:00.000-05:002006-03-23T04:30:00.000-05:00What a fantastic opportunity. That Anum chose to ...What a fantastic opportunity. That Anum chose to respond honestly and sincerely to these questions and post her answers for all to see and dissect is truly commendable.<BR/><BR/>Regardless of the specifics that many here have addressed, one can't help but to come away with a better appreciation of the distance between devout Muslim beliefs and traditional American/Western ideals.<BR/><BR/>Religion doesn't matter much in the typical Western mindset. Not so for much of the world, especially the Muslim parts.<BR/><BR/>The Eurolib elites and American university despots will tell you that the current clash is due to past international territorial disputes, or 20th-century corporate greed, or lack of economic opportunity.<BR/><BR/>But the main difference is RELIGION and CULTURE. No one is at fault for those things, but when they clash, there is no quick and easy cause, nor is there a quick and easy fix.<BR/><BR/>The divide between modern Western and Muslim values is HUGE, as Anum's interview here clearly indicates.<BR/><BR/>We are lucky for this unfiltered opportunity to learn.<BR/><BR/>orangeducksorangeduckshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16785747398831123311noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143095593001347542006-03-23T01:33:00.000-05:002006-03-23T01:33:00.000-05:00Pim's Ghost,Does "Allah" use this way of describin...Pim's Ghost,<BR/><I>Does "Allah" use this way of describing Himself? As "I Am"?</I><BR/><BR/>Yes.<BR/>Unlike the Bible where Yahve is only "quoted" from time to time, The Qur'an is believed to be exact words of Allah, who revealed all this jazz to Mo during numerous sessions.<BR/>It's funny though because on 2 occasions Muhammed forgot about the fact it was supposed to be Allah speaking anh addresses his audience as Mo himself:<BR/><BR/>6:104 Proofs have come unto <B>you from your Lord, </B>so whoso seeth, it is for his own good, and whoso is blind is blind to his own hurt. <B>And I am not a keeper over you.</B><BR/><BR/>6:114 <B>Shall I seek other than Allah for judge, when He it is Who hath revealed unto you (this) Scripture, fully explained ? </B> Those unto whom We gave the Scripture (aforetime) know that it is revealed from thy Lord in truth. So be not thou (O Muhammad) of the waverers.<BR/><BR/>Obviously Mo forgot himself a little bit (one does get tired) and the scribes did not dare to change these verses.Dan Zarembahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09067140150563192288noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143088731266590602006-03-22T23:38:00.000-05:002006-03-22T23:38:00.000-05:00It's just such a major theme both in Judaism and i...It's just such a major theme both in Judaism and in Christianity. Even Jesus said this. <BR/><BR/>Maybe Eteraz or Avenging Apostate would weigh in.Kiddohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05626502212185158978noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143088169241778142006-03-22T23:29:00.000-05:002006-03-22T23:29:00.000-05:00p.g. - an excellent question you should probably p...p.g. - an excellent question you should probably pointedly pose to missing link or american crusader. now, i am curious also. <BR/><BR/>i do know that "ala" in hebrew is a curse and "12" times in the o.t. is used specifically for this purpose. as eschatology and gematria in the bible interest me, "12" is a divine to the Divine.nanchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08809768490674110768noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143087623236420502006-03-22T23:20:00.000-05:002006-03-22T23:20:00.000-05:00I have a theological question, actually. The God o...I have a theological question, actually. The God of the Jews and Christians referred to Himself by saying "I Am". YHWH. Is this statement similarly recorded and if so, studied in the Quran? Does "Allah" use this way of describing Himself? As "I Am"?<BR/><BR/>Just something that occurred to me while reading this, and now I'm quite curious.Kiddohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05626502212185158978noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143087167079952592006-03-22T23:12:00.000-05:002006-03-22T23:12:00.000-05:00missing link = one of my new heros, drummaster - i...missing link = one of my new heros, drummaster - i was limited on time today and ran out of koranlet paper or by G-d i would have cited it!<BR/><BR/>loo-loo skip to the loo!<BR/><BR/>thanks drummaster.nanchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08809768490674110768noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143086701381160272006-03-22T23:05:00.000-05:002006-03-22T23:05:00.000-05:00nanc and missing link:excellent work!! [golf clapp...nanc and missing link:<BR/><BR/>excellent work!! [golf clapping]drummaster2001https://www.blogger.com/profile/08589193884537906521noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143086571448664872006-03-22T23:02:00.001-05:002006-03-22T23:02:00.001-05:00silly me - i should have known by your accent! ll...silly me - i should have known by your accent! llol!nanchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08809768490674110768noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143086527711138072006-03-22T23:02:00.000-05:002006-03-22T23:02:00.000-05:00you mean you're not a brutha?you mean you're not a brutha?nanchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08809768490674110768noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143085667077657792006-03-22T22:47:00.000-05:002006-03-22T22:47:00.000-05:00beamish is definitely a roman god. definitely.I do...<I>beamish is definitely a roman god. definitely.</I><BR/><BR/>I do have a fondness for Ancient European mythology, but I'm a mere mortal.<BR/><BR/>Beak - I'm a ethnic mutt. "Caucasian" on most census forms, even though I've never been to the Ukraine.(((Thought Criminal)))https://www.blogger.com/profile/17311656184275255223noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143084354286963722006-03-22T22:25:00.000-05:002006-03-22T22:25:00.000-05:00i never had any doubts - i just doubt she is a she...i never had any doubts - i just doubt she is a she. and i've made my appearance and appeal at the site you posted. we need to be in the mindset of this being ideological, no more, no less.<BR/><BR/>my son-in-law is an apologetics pastor and i am going to grill him this weekend.nanchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08809768490674110768noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143083039104660122006-03-22T22:03:00.000-05:002006-03-22T22:03:00.000-05:00Nanc,If you have any doubts about Anum's loyalties...Nanc,<BR/>If you have any doubts about Anum's loyalties check out American Crusaider's comments section here: http://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=17233580&postID=114305835604895733Dan Zarembahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09067140150563192288noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143082663515617582006-03-22T21:57:00.000-05:002006-03-22T21:57:00.000-05:00Missing Link's citations--Wow!Missing Link's citations--Wow!Always On Watchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01216119321836479641noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143079653321118052006-03-22T21:07:00.000-05:002006-03-22T21:07:00.000-05:00tooshay aow and missing link. great points, set a...tooshay aow and missing link. great points, set and match.nanchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08809768490674110768noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11044955.post-1143078307842018982006-03-22T20:45:00.000-05:002006-03-22T20:45:00.000-05:00Anum,You are either a not a very strict Muslim or ...Anum,<BR/>You are either a not a very strict Muslim or just pretend not to understand the Qur'an (perhaps your knowledge of the Holy Scripture is not very good).<BR/>Muslims and Infidels work together???<BR/><BR/>"Believers, Jews, Christians, and Sabaeans -- whoever believes in God and the Last Day and does what is right -- shall be rewarded by their Lord; they have nothing to fear or to regret." Qur'an 2:62"<BR/><BR/>The verse you quote from The Cow<BR/>can only apply if the they do convert - the stress should be on: <BR/><B> "and does what is right" </B><BR/><BR/>To make thinks absolutely clear your Allah expressed his real will a few verses "later":<BR/><BR/>2:87 And verily We gave unto Moses the Scripture and We caused a train of messengers to follow after him, and We gave unto Jesus, son of Mary, clear proofs (of Allah's sovereignty), and We supported him with the Holy spirit. Is it ever so, that, when there cometh unto you a messenger (from Allah) with that which ye yourselves desire not, ye grow arrogant, and some ye disbelieve and some ye slay ? <BR/>2:88 And they say: Our hearts are hardened. Nay, but Allah hath cursed them for their unbelief. Little is that which they believe<BR/><BR/>Despite Allah's teachings the people of the Scripture do not really believe and so good Allah cursed them!!<BR/><BR/>And just to make sure that other Muslims dod not get confused which verse (or part of it) should apply, Allah invented another rule:<BR/>"the latest rule replaces the previous one".<BR/><BR/>2:106 Nothing of our revelation (even a single verse) do we abrogate or cause be forgotten, but we bring (in place) one better or the like thereof. Knowest thou not that Allah is Able to do all things?<BR/><BR/>And so Allh clearly states that we, infidels have DIFFERENT gods than Muslims:<BR/><BR/>2:257 Allah is the Protecting Guardian of those who believe. He bringeth them out of darkness into light. <B>As for those who disbelieve, their patrons are false deities.</B> They bring them out of light into darkness. Such are rightful owners of the Fire. They will abide therein.<BR/><BR/>And so you may tolerate Infidels for a while untill Allah decides otherwise:<BR/><BR/>2:109 Many of the people of the Scripture long to make you disbelievers after your belief, through envy on their own account, after the truth hath become manifest unto them. Forgive and be indulgent (toward them) until Allah give command. Lo! Allah is Able to do all things.<BR/><BR/>And of course at the end it is your duty to fight the Infidel or otherwise you can find yourself in hell:<BR/>9:73 O Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites! Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end.<BR/><BR/>9:81 Those who were left behind rejoiced at sitting still behind the messenger of Allah, and were averse to striving with their wealth and their lives in Allah's way. And they said: Go not forth in the heat! Say: The fire of hell is more intense of heat, if they but understood.Dan Zarembahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09067140150563192288noreply@blogger.com